Millionaire Interview 439

Here’s our latest interview with a millionaire as we seek to learn from those who have grown their wealth to high heights.

If you’d like to be considered for an interview, drop me a note and we can chat about specifics.

This interview took place in November.

My questions are in bold italics and their responses follow in black.

Let’s get started…

OVERVIEW

How old are you (and spouse if applicable, plus how long you’ve been married)?

I’m 39, my husband is 38, and we’ve been married for 10 years. We met right after I moved from China to the US in 2012 while I was working on my MBA.

He was starting his career as a professor at the same university. But don’t worry—he wasn’t my professor!

Do you have kids/family (if so, how old are they)?

Yes! We have two amazing kids: a 7-year-old boy and a 4-year-old girl. They keep us busy and laughing every day!

Both my husband and I always knew we wanted kids, and having them in our early 30s felt like the perfect timing for us. By then, we had finished our graduate/postgraduate education and were more established in our careers.

Looking back, it was definitely the right choice. We had the stability and flexibility to provide for them, and we were in a place where we could be fully engaged and hands-on in their lives.

It’s been such a rewarding journey, and we’re grateful for the timing and experiences that have shaped our family life.

What area of the country do you live in (and urban or rural)?

We live in a suburb of Phoenix, Arizona, and we absolutely love it here! The weather is perfect for outdoor activities almost all year, so our kids spend a lot of time outside—which is great for their growth and development.

The charter schools are affordable and top-notch, giving our kids the kind of education we want now and plenty of flexibility for the future.

In 2020, after commuting 100 miles every week for six years, my husband was able to find a job that lets us live together every day. So, we moved from Chicago to Phoenix.

We quickly realized how much more affordable housing is here. It’s made a huge difference in our quality of life.

Our house is at the foot of a mountain, across from a large park, and just a short walk from the kids’ school. They each have their own rooms and bathrooms, plus a media room, a playroom, and a backyard with a pool and trampoline.

It’s pretty much perfect!

The local government here is also super supportive of small businesses, which has been a huge help since I made the leap from corporate life to full-time entrepreneurship last March.

Overall, Phoenix has been the perfect place for our family—great weather, amazing schools, and a business-friendly vibe. We couldn’t be happier!

What is your current net worth?

$3,014,033 as of September 27th, 2024.

What are the main assets that make up your net worth (stocks, real estate, business, home, retirement accounts, etc.) and any debt that offsets part of these?

Real Estate: $1.3 million (net of a $0.9M mortgage). We own two single-family homes in the Greater Phoenix area—one for us and one for my parents to use in the winter, which we rent out the rest of the year. We also have a duplex in Chicago that’s rented out.

Retirement Accounts: $1.1 million, mostly invested in low-cost index funds.

HSA, 529, and Brokerage Accounts: $0.6 million, all in stocks and ETFs.

We don’t keep an emergency fund since my husband’s job is very secure. Plus, we have plenty of backup options if an emergency arises—HSA, credit cards, brokerage account, HELOC, you name it!

Lastly, we have a small stake in venture capital, and I’m growing my own business in financial life planning, which we hope will grow significantly over time.

EARN

What is your job?

I’m building my own business in financial life planning. Before that, I was a finance manager at a small subsidiary of an international candy company.

My husband is a tenured business professor.

What is your annual income?

My business is still just breaking even. My husband earns $240k a year.

Before I left my corporate job in 2023, our combined income was around $350k.

Tell us about your income performance over time. What was the starting salary of your first job, how did it grow from there (and what you did to make it grow), and where are you now?

Let’s take a trip down memory lane! My very first full-time job was as a Strategy and Development Associate at a social enterprise in China back in 2009.

I was promised 6,000 RMB a month (about $900 USD at the time), but here’s the twist—I never actually got paid! Talk about a wake-up call as I stepped out of the ivory tower and into the real world!

After that, I made the jump from “impact” to “income” when I landed a consulting role with a Private Equity firm that sent me to West Africa. This time, I was making 20,000 RMB ($2,900) a month, plus amazing perks like housing, a driver, food, and travel expenses.

It was a game-changer, and I was finally on track to save up for my dream of studying abroad.

Let me add some context here—I didn’t come from wealth. Both of my parents were teachers in China.

In my third year of college, I mentioned wanting to pursue a master’s degree abroad, since quite a few of my classmates were aiming for the UK or US, of course.

My parents were pretty blunt: “We won’t fund it. We’ve saved some money, but it’s for your down payment on an apartment when you get a job.” So, I decided to take matters into my own hands and save up for my dream.

They did agree to pay for a two-year master’s program in China, but instead of the typical coursework, I dove into French. Why? Because I wanted to work for the United Nations and contribute to world peace!

My language skills ended up becoming my ticket to the Private Equity job when my social enterprise career didn’t work out. I was fluent in both English and French, and let’s face it, not many people with a cushy background wanted to work in one of the world’s least developed countries.

But for me? It was a no-brainer!

After seeing the work of organizations like USAID, Peace Corps, and The World Bank in Mauritania (don’t get me wrong, they are doing good things too!), and comparing it to the lives we changed through jobs we created in Private Equity, my outlook changed.

I went from being a romantic tree-hugger to a firm believer in the power of good business. So, I shifted my focus for further studies from political science to business, and in 2011, I was accepted into an MBA program in the U.S.— and it was fully funded! 

Then came my big move to the U.S.! After surviving 80-hour work weeks in Private Equity, I knew that lifestyle wasn’t for me.

So, I pivoted into corporate finance for a better work-life balance. After completing my MBA, I started as a Senior Financial Analyst in 2014 with a salary of $75,000 (or $6,250 a month).

It was lower than most of my classmates’ starting salaries, but I worked hard, switched to a company with better benefits and culture in 2016, and earned annual raises and a promotion in 2019. By the time I left corporate life in 2023, I was earning $160,000 a year (or $13,333 a month) as a Finance Manager.

Now, I’m in my second year of building my own business. I joke that it’s double the work for a fraction of the pay compared to my corporate gig, but I’m loving it.

I’m finally pursuing what I’m truly passionate about, and I know it’s all part of the long-term plan! 

What tips do you have for others who want to grow their career-related income?

Don’t quit your dream—work hard to fund it, or build skills that make you more employable! 

And here’s a big one: Don’t quit your career just because you’re a parent, even if a nanny costs as much as your salary. Stick with it—it gets better! When I had my son in 2017, I seriously thought about quitting. But I stuck it out, earned my CPA, and got promoted to manager in 2019.

Once you become a people manager, you get more control over your work. My secret? Delegate the busy work and focus on the strategic, fun tasks. It’ll change everything! 

What’s your work-life balance look like?

Right now, it’s great!

I take 6 weeks off in the summer and 2 weeks during Christmas and New Year’s.

I make my own schedule: I work from 6AM to 7:30 AM, then get the kids ready for school.

After that, I work from 8AM to 5PM. I don’t work on weekends.

Do you have any sources of income besides your career? If so, can you list them, give us a feel for how much you earn with each, and offer some insight into how you developed them?

Yes, we own a duplex in Chicago that generates positive cash flow.

SAVE

What is your annual spending?

Around $160k for things like home, kids, travel (1-2 international trips, 2-3 domestic trips per year), dining, etc.

What are the main categories (expenses) this spending breaks into?

• Mortgage & Utilities: $50k
• Childcare & Kids Activities: $25k
• Travel: $20k
• Food & Dining: $15k
• Insurance: $10k
• Car Loan & Fuel: $5k
• Other: $35k

Do you have a budget? If so, how do you implement it?

For us, we used to have a budget that divided our disposable income equally after covering our savings and essentials. Now, we’ve shifted to a more flexible approach.

We’re both frugal and considerate, so we rarely have financial disagreements as long as we keep our goals clear and communicate openly!

What percentage of your gross income do you save and how has that changed over time?

We used to save an impressive 40% of our household income for years, but now it’s dropped to 25% since I left the corporate world to build my business.

My goal? To get back up to that 40% in the next three years!

What’s your best tip for saving (accumulating) money?

Mind Where You Shop: We get groceries from Winco Foods, snag clothes at Kid to Kid and ThredUp (high quality second-hand items), and find furniture and home decor treasures at estate sales or auctions like https://ctbids.com/.

Utilize Tax-Advantaged Accounts: We prioritize maxing out our HSA, 529 plans (up to state tax benefits), and tax-deferred accounts in that order.

Plan Taxes as a Family: include your parents, kids, and your business(es) in your tax planning! It’s wise to consult with a tax professional to craft personalized strategies that work best for and evolve with your situation.

What’s your best tip for spending less money?

Negotiation is a valuable life skill—learn to enjoy it!

What is your favorite thing to spend money on/your secret splurge?

Travel and local food! Some of the best memories are made on the road and often cost very little.

For example, a 1.5-5 euro croissant or crepe in the Netherlands and France (depending on whether it’s from Aldi or a storefront), 15 RMB ($2) for dumplings and noodles in China, or a 20 baht ($0.60) fruit drink on the busy streets of Bangkok, the freshly caught fish with black peppercorn and rice on a traditional sailboat in Mauritania’s Banc d’Arguin National Park, the list goes on.

It’s always a treat to discover something new that you love and want to come back to after exploring all the new places!

INVEST

What is your investment philosophy/plan?

Start by leveraging your salary for solid real estate deals, then focus on low-cost index funds for steady growth. Maximize employee benefits and tax-advantaged accounts.

Never let your money sit idle, and don’t panic when the market dips. Keep investing in yourself—your resourcefulness, employable skills and investment knowledge are your ultimate safety net.

What has been your best investment?

Duplex in Chicago (cash-positive). Primary home in Phoenix (almost doubled in value in 4 years).

Our marriage and kids – a fulfilling journey of growth and connection.

What has been your worst investment?

Not spending more on early childcare for my son. I joined a nanny share to save money back in 2018, but the other family didn’t share our parenting philosophy, leading to a lot of stress.

I should have just hired a nanny, even though it would have cost more. We adjusted our budget for our second child.

What’s been your overall return?

Around 17% annually (real estate and equity combined).

How often do you monitor/review your portfolio?

For fun: daily. For tracking: quarterly.

NET WORTH

How did you accumulate your net worth?

We had high-income jobs and saved/invested about 40% of our income. Our investments were solid, and we got lucky with both real estate and the stock market.

Duplex in Chicago: Bought for $700k (20% down) in 2016, now worth $800k. It generates $15k/year in net cash flow after repairs, maintenance, management fees, and mortgage (30-year mortgage at 3%).

House in Phoenix: Bought for $560k (20% down) in 2020, now worth $900k. It has a 15-year mortgage at 2.25%.

The S&P 500’s return over the past decade is 182.7% as of Oct 2024, and we got lucky with some individual stocks.

What would you say is your greatest strength in the ESI wealth-building model (Earn, Save or Invest) and why would you say it’s tops?

All three are strong for us, but earning is probably the foundation.

It’s the first step and provides the ultimate safety net for everything else.

What road bumps did you face along the way to becoming a millionaire and how did you handle them?

The market downturn in 2022 was tough, but we stuck with our strategy and were fine.

If the downturn had lasted longer or been worse, we would have likely stayed the course with our investments, while cutting back on home services, finding cheaper travel deals, and spending less on food and dining.

What are you currently doing to maintain/grow your net worth?

Keep investing, grow my business, and teach my kids how to be financially responsible. 

Do you have a target net worth you are trying to attain?

Nope! More money won’t really change much for us.

Our net worth has been growing quickly anyway: $1M in 2019, $2M by 2021-2022, and $3M in 2024!

How old were you when you made your first million and have you had any significant behavior shifts since then?

I was 34 when we hit our first million. Honestly, nothing changed at that point!

The real shift came when we hit $2M. Since then, I earned another master’s degree (in innovation and venture development), retired from my corporate job, and went full-time into building my own business and following my passion.

What personal habits and/or traits have you developed that have made you successful at growing your net worth?

Resilience, frugality, a love of lifelong learning, and never giving up on your passion (That last one’s more about motivation and well-being than just net worth!).

What money mistakes have you made along the way that others can learn from?

I wish I’d quit my corporate job earlier. You don’t need to hit a big financial goal to follow your dreams.

A solid plan and the flexibility to adapt are more than enough.

What advice do you have for ESI Money readers on how to become wealthy?

Making money is a life skill—go out and learn it, get good at it, but don’t let it control you. 💪

Summer of 2023, I had a small reunion with my college roommates in Palais de Longchamp, France. It got me thinking about how different our paths have been.

One roommate immigrated to Spain, but now works in the UK. Another moved to Germany, worked hard to learn the language, earned a degree, and just bought her first home with her husband.

Then, there’s the one who stayed in China after a year-long assignment in Kenya. None of them were financially free, or even close to it. But I was.

Looking at their journeys, I realized how much living and working in the U.S. has helped me build wealth. Here, it’s relatively easy to earn a degree and start building homeownership— especially if you’re in a smaller city or willing to live in the suburbs.

Salaries in the U.S. are often higher than in Europe for people with similar skills, and our stock market has outperformed much of the world in the last decade.

Yes, the U.S. also comes with higher economic disparity compared to other developed countries, and many of us have to pay for things like education, healthcare, long-term care, and much of our retirement.

But the longer I work in the industry, the more I see the U.S. as the “Wild West.” There are endless opportunities for the informed, skilled, and brave, yet most people never achieve financial freedom.

That’s why I believe financial education, and more importantly, experiential learning, are key to economic empowerment. I’m passionate about inspiring, educating, and supporting others to take control of their financial futures.

The U.S. offers a great environment, and we shouldn’t waste it. Each moment is an opportunity to make a difference, build wealth, and live our best lives!

FUTURE

What are your plans for the future regarding lifestyle?

We have two sabbaticals planned over the next decade or so. I also want to spend more time helping my parents and traveling with them before they get too old.

While work has become optional, I plan to keep working and making an impact in areas that matter to me.

What are your retirement plans?

I have a few ideas! I might start a U-pick orchard on the northwest coast, a meditation center, or a nonprofit to support cycle breakers (e.g., first-gen college students, those escaping generational poverty, survivors of domestic violence, etc.).

I also hope to coach more women and people of color to become financial life planners.

Are there any issues in retirement that concern you? If so, how are you planning to address them?

The biggest concern is long-term care for my parents.

I’m learning from others in the FIRE community, preparing myself to be more accepting, and making the most of the time I have with them.

MISCELLANEOUS

How did you learn about finances and at what age did it “click”?

I’ve always been frugal and had a goal of earning 300k RMB (about $39,000) in college (2007) to study abroad. I hit that goal in 2011 and ended up getting a full scholarship with a stipend.

So I gave 150k RMB ($23,500) to my parents. I spent 70k RMB ($11k) traveling the world for 45 days and saved the rest for my studies in the US.

In 2016, I calculated my financial freedom goal using the 4% rule, and achieved it in 2021.

Who inspired you to excel in life? Who are your heroes?

There are too many to count!

Some of my heroes include:

• Nelson Mandela
• Mother Teresa
• Bill Drayton (Founder of Ashoka)
• Master Jing Hui (my Zen master who passed away in 2013)
• George Kinder (Father of Financial Life Planning)

Do you have any favorite money books you like/recommend? If so, can you share with us your top three and why you like them?

Here are my top three:

• The Psychology of Money by Morgan Housel – It’s a beginner’s read that explores how emotions and behavior shape our financial decisions.
• Your Money Or Your Life by Joseph R. Dominguez and Vicki Robin – A classic that transforms the way we think about money and life.
• The Seven Stages of Money Maturity by George D. Kinder – A deep dive into how our relationship with money evolves over time.

This year, I’m also writing a book on money and couples, with a special chapter for cross-cultural couples. Hope it’s going to be good!

Do you give to charity? Why or why not? If you do, what percent of time/money do you give?

Right now, I’m not giving to charity other than used personal items to goodwill.

Because I want to be a smart steward of my money first! I’m still figuring out which causes I really care about and how my contributions can make the biggest impact.

But in the future, I have some plans in mind! I’d love to give back $250k each to my high school and undergrad in China and a million to the university that awarded me my full scholarship to come to the US.

Plus, I’ll support other organizations based on my financial situation and the impact I want to make at that time!

Do you plan to leave an inheritance for your heirs (how do you plan to distribute your wealth at your death)? What are your reasons behind this plan?

Absolutely! I want to leave just enough for my kids and future generations to cover a college education or equivalent of their basic living expenses.

This way, they can chase their passions without worrying about essentials. I believe it’s important for them to learn how to be independent and feel fulfilled in their pursuits!

As for the rest, I’m all about giving back—so it’ll go to charity.